Thursday, 27 September 2012

Did Jesus said "I am" Or "I Have"

Did Jesus said "I am" Or "I Have"

Did Jesus said "I am" Or "I Have"

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Did Jesus said "I am" Or "I Have"

1- Jesus was a descendant of Abraham
2- Abraham father of Jews and Jesus
3- What did Jews really asked
4- Mistranslation of Verse John 8:58
5- Conclusion

1- First of all Jesus was one of the descendant of Abraham. This is also confirmed by Mathhew 1:1-16

1 This is the genealogy of Jesus the Messiah the son of David, the son of Abraham: 
2 Abraham was the father of Isaac, Isaac the father of Jacob, Jacob the father of Judah and his brothers,
3 Judah the father of Perez and Zerah, whose mother was Tamar, Perez the father of Hezron, Hezron the father of Ram,
4 Ram the father of Amminadab, Amminadab the father of Nahshon, Nahshon the father of Salmon,
5 Salmon the father of Boaz, whose mother was Rahab, Boaz the father of Obed, whose mother was Ruth, Obed the father of Jesse,
6 and Jesse the father of King David. David was the father of Solomon, whose mother had been Uriah’s wife,
7 Solomon the father of Rehoboam, Rehoboam the father of Abijah, Abijah the father of Asa,
8 Asa the father of Jehoshaphat, Jehoshaphat the father of Jehoram, Jehoram the father of Uzziah,
9 Uzziah the father of Jotham, Jotham the father of Ahaz, Ahaz the father of Hezekiah,
10 Hezekiah the father of Manasseh, Manasseh the father of Amon, Amon the father of Josiah,
11 and Josiah the father of Jeconiah[c] and his brothers at the time of the exile to Babylon.
12 After the exile to Babylon: Jeconiah was the father of Shealtiel, Shealtiel the father of Zerubbabel,
13 Zerubbabel the father of Abihud, Abihud the father of Eliakim, Eliakim the father of Azor,
14 Azor the father of Zadok, Zadok the father of Akim, Akim the father of Elihud,
15 Elihud the father of Eleazar, Eleazar the father of Matthan, Matthan the father of Jacob,
16 and Jacob the father of Joseph, the husband of Mary, and Mary was the mother of Jesus who is called the Messiah.

2- As Jesus was one of the descendant of Abraham so he (Abraham) was the Father of all Jews and even Jesus

The Children of Abraham
31 To the Jews who had believed him, Jesus said, "If you hold to my teaching, you are really my disciples.
32 Then you will know the truth, and the truth will set you free."
33 They answered him, "We are Abraham's descendants and have never been slaves of anyone. How can you say that we shall be set free?"
34 Jesus replied, "I tell you the truth, everyone who sins is a slave to sin.
35 Now a slave has no permanent place in the family, but a son belongs to it forever.
36 So if the Son sets you free, you will be free indeed.
37 I know you are Abraham's descendants. Yet you are ready to kill me, because you have no room for my word.
38 I am telling you what I have seen in the Father's presence, and you do what you have heard from your father."
39 "Abraham is our father," they answered. "If you were Abraham's children," said Jesus, "then you would do the things Abraham did.
40 As it is, you are determined to kill me, a man who has told you the truth that I heard from God. Abraham did not do such things.
41 You are doing the things your own father does." "We are not illegitimate children," they protested. "The only Father we have is God himself."

3- What did Jews really asked

Picking a verse from the whole context to justify your claim is not veracious. You should read the whole context to see what is really happening.

The Context Goes Like this:

51 I tell you the truth, if anyone keeps my word, he will never see death."
52 At this the Jews exclaimed, "Now we know that you are demon-possessed! Abraham died and so did the prophets, yet you say that if anyone keeps your word, he will never taste death.
53 Are you greater than our father Abraham? He died, and so did the prophets. Who do you think you are?"
54 Jesus replied, "If I glorify myself, my glory means nothing. My Father, whom you claim as your God, is the one who glorifies me.
55 Though you do not know him, I know him. If I said I did not, I would be a liar like you, but I do know him and keep his word.
56 Your father Abraham rejoiced at the thought of seeing my day; he saw it and was glad."
57 "You are not yet fifty years old," the Jews said to him, "and you have seen Abraham?
58 "I tell you the truth," Jesus answered, "before Abraham was born, I am (I have seen Abraham before he was even born)!"

Some points to be noted here:

1- Jesus confimred that Abraham was rejoicing after seeing Jesus's days and was glad
2- Jesus was one of the offspring of Abraham and he was his father
3- The Important point is Jews asked "Have You SEEN ABRAHAM?" And in the answer Jesus must have replied "I have seen Abraham before he was Born" (See Confirmation Below)

4- Mistranslation of Verse John 8:58

Some Christian claim Jesus Divinity through John 8:58 and then support it by Exodus 3:14

John 8:58
"I tell you the truth," Jesus answered, "before Abraham was born, I am!"
Exodus 3:14
"God said to Moses, "I AM who I am. This is what you are to say to the Israelites: `I AM has sent me to you.'"

Now by Jesus Saying "I Am" identically as God said "I Am" in Exodus 3, Christians assume Jesus is identifying himself as God.

If we objectively research the history of this verse, we will see that the Older and more authentic Bibles actually reveal that in John 8:58, Jesus does not say "I am" but in reality says "I -was" or "I have" . In later centuries, translators manipulated the translation to try to elevate status of Jesus.
The Greek Septuagint Version, which is the one the Apostles quoted from in the first century, renders Exodus 3:14 as " ego' eimi' ho Ohn'," which translates "I am the Being". The Greek words at John 8:58 "ego eimi" show the use of the verb "eimi" in the historical present because Jesus was talking about himself in relation to Abraham's past.

That is why some translations render it differently.

For example, An American Translation reads. "I existed before Abraham was born!",
Moffatt, "I have existed before Abraham was born",
Sacred Bible, "Before Abraham existed, I was existing",
The New Testament, "Jesus said to them, 'I tell you, I existed before Abraham was born!",
The Four Gospels According the the Sinaitic Palimpsest, "He said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Before Abraham was, I have been.",
The Twentieth Century New Testament, "Believe me 'Jesus replied, 'before Abraham was born I was already what I am.",
The Modern New Testament, "Jesus said to them, Truly, truly, I say to you, Before Abraham was born, I was.",
The Syriac New Testament, "Jesus said to them: Verily, verily, I say to you, That before Abraham existed, I was."

Jesus knew he existed before the world was made, but this doesn't prove he was God Almighty. (See John 17:5) Many angels also existed before the world was created. (Job 38:7)

In Exodus 3:14 God was using this as a title and name to be used against the Egyptians. A Bible scholar Dr. J.H. Hertz said that in that phrase 'I am that I am' the main emphasis in on the active manifestation of God's Divine existence. He said that God was about to show himself in behalf of his people in great and wonderful way. He said that "I will be what I will be" is also an approved rendering.

The footnote to the NASB Bible agrees and says, "1.14 Or I WILL BE WHAT I WILL BE".
When Jesus used the phrase he was not using it as a name or title. He was only explaining his pre-human existence. Thus in harmony with the above, the NWT (New World Translation) correctly translates that verse as: "Jesus said to them: "Most truly I say to you Before Abraham came into existence, I have been."

Be upto date for article Mistransalation of John 8:58 and comparing it with Exodus 3:14

5- Conclusion

Trinity is once again dealt a big blow that exposed its falsehood and blasphemies.  Trinity is no more than a man-made idol-worship of Jesus Christ.  It is a blasphemy and utterly rejected by GOD Almighty in both the Bible and the Glorious Quran. The following verses clearly demonstrate this:

"They surely disbelieve who say: Lo! Allah is the third of three; when there is no God save the One God. If they desist not from so saying a painful doom will fall on those of them who disbelieve.  (Quran 5:73)"

"Hear, O Israel: The LORD our God, the LORD is one.  (Deuteronomy 6:4)"

"The most important one," answered Jesus, "is this: 'Hear, O Israel, the Lord our God, the Lord is one.  (Mark 12:29)

A Commentary On Four Gospels
Destruction of Trinity
Jesus will not be KILLED and will be SAVED
Crucifixion refuted by Bible Again
Bible gods knows everything but not Something

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